Coop, perhaps you want to reword this 23

NewSpring preacher, Brad Cooper, summarizes his latest sermon on worship like this:

Worship should matter to us because WE BECOME WHAT WE WORSHIP! So right now as you read these very words you are evolving into your object of Worship. There’s only 2 kinds of Worship objects in this world: GOD & BAD – So who are you becoming?

Are we really evolving into God?

The idea appears in the statement four times, so it doesn’t seem to be accidental.

Screen shot 2009-09-18 at 2.28.15 PM

23 thoughts on “Coop, perhaps you want to reword this

  1. James Downing Sep 18, 2009 2:39 pm

    Huh?!?

  2. James Duncan Sep 18, 2009 2:45 pm

    I think that’s an appropriate response, Downing.

    One other thing that’s consistent with what else we’ve seen of Cooper’s teaching on worship. It’s all about us. As if worship is a multiple choice option where I pick the object that will work out best for me.

    How could Job have justified worshiping a God who could slay him if our choices are expected to be so self affirming?

    When we worship God properly, we become NOTHING.

  3. James Downing Sep 18, 2009 3:07 pm

    I think we need a decoder ring on this one. It may have helped if he had pointed to the Scripture where he got this idea…but, I’m sure he could just do what Perry always does and take half of a verse about something different, and proudly declare as God’s endorsement of his idea.

    Like to add to your thought, Duncan – True worship can only begin at a place of humility. If we are seeking to better ourselves (become God), then we are not actually worshipping.

  4. scott Sep 18, 2009 4:30 pm

    we worship christ… we become more like christ… i thought christian meant christ-like. doesnt paul talk about trying to become perfect like christ?

  5. Paul Sep 18, 2009 4:31 pm

    he’s just emulating what he sees his pastor do every week. why should we be surprised? perhaps cooper has been reading mormon theology.

  6. David J Horn Sep 18, 2009 7:15 pm

    The more I read Cooper’s message the more confused I am by it. What is he saying?

    Paul,

    It does sound like something Joseph Smith would say. I wonder if Brad has been talking to Joel Osteen?

  7. James Duncan Sep 18, 2009 8:01 pm

    As my title suggests, I think this is more dumb than it is evil.

    Problem is, how does this get past his doctrinal filters? It is so obviously wrong.

  8. James Downing Sep 18, 2009 10:54 pm

    I feel for Brad. I really do. He probably has a good heart, great passion…but no guidance. If he were in a church where he would be held accountable and molded to biblical standards, he could be a great assett to the ministry someday.As is, he’s being handicapped by lack of refinement.

  9. KeithO Sep 19, 2009 11:32 am

    @ Scott,

    You are on to something, but Paul is not talking about worship in this case. In fact, I don’t think we worship Christ, we worship God. Christ tells us to be perfect (or holy) as the father is perfect, but that doesn’t mean we become God. We become transformed through a process that enables us to be equipped to live in the Kingdom of God and to think and act in Kingdom terms. We don’t have to be God to do that, just tuned into what he is about and his purposes.

    Would like to hear from others about this.

  10. James Downing Sep 19, 2009 6:03 pm

    Well Keith, I we definitely say we are to worship Christ as part of the trinitarian Godhead.

  11. David J Horn Sep 19, 2009 7:24 pm

    I see Brad’s intention but it’s poorly worded.

  12. KeithO Sep 19, 2009 8:08 pm

    James Downing,

    I leave the real deep discussions about the Trinity to those who can handle it much better than me. The pragmatist in me takes its que from Jesus teaching us to pray to the “Father, the one in the heavens”.

    I hear you and thank you, but you may be thinking I’m missing the obvious point of “God in three persons”, but I come down on the side of three distinct persons, otherwise why would Paul talk about Christ not considering equality with God something to be held on to in Phillipians 2, or Christ teaching us to pray to God? Again, I assume you are much better equipped to handle the nuances of the trinity better than me; I’m merely suggesting these ideas about worship being to God, as Jesus taught us to pray to God, but understanding the intermediary role of Christ and the interpretive role of the spirit. If I am missing something, please let me know.

  13. Josh Sep 22, 2009 9:32 am

    Well, we’ll clearly worship the Lamb who sits in God’s throne in Rev. 22:3, so we may as well start now 🙂

    As to what Cooper said in that little blurb: I’m pretty sure he is suggesting that we become more “like” whatever we worship. That kind of makes sense, so long as we are worshiping a person. For example, kids who idolize Hannah Montana will become more like Hannah Montana, though they will never actually become Hannah Montana. If we idolize Jesus Christ, we should become more Christ-like, even though we will never actually become Christ. This isn’t really the deepest teaching ever, but I think it’s pretty consistent with the bible. (“For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.” Mat. 6:1)

    The way it’s written really does sound like Mormon doctrine, though.

  14. Ben Sep 22, 2009 10:07 am

    I was volunteering at this service and heard it first hand.

    1) He was speaking to 6th, 7th, and 8th graders. If it doesn’t seem very deep that might be why. My 6th grader understood it.

    2) Josh, if memory serves, he actually used the example of Hannah Montana and pretty much said exactly what you said.

    3) This message was about putting other things ahead of Christ. Perhaps you guys could break down the part of the message where Brad warns the kids about worshipping a building or the emotion of the moment. That was also stressed the week before by the guest speaker. Both reminded the kids that they should come to church to worship Christ and not just because it’s a nice building or that their friends are there. I don’t expect that you will since that would go against the impression you are trying to create of Newspring.

  15. James Downing Sep 22, 2009 10:19 am

    Ben – We aren’t creating any impression of Newspring. This is exactly what they have posted, we just repost it and discuss it. The point is, and was made clear even in the title of this post, that Cooper should be much more careful with his wording. If he had said what you and Josh said, there wouldn’t be an issue. He did not.

  16. Ben Sep 22, 2009 10:25 am

    Do you EVER post anything positive about Newspring or do you pull segments out of sermons to try to make a point?

    Brad did say what I said he said. Watch the entire service.

  17. James Downing Sep 22, 2009 10:30 am

    This isn’t pulled from a sermon, it is directly from Brad’s blog. Exact quote with link included.

    Poor wording. Didn’t say what he meant. Said something different during the service. I understand. So, Let me just requote Duncan’s title:

    “Coop, perhaps you want to reword this.”

  18. Ben Sep 22, 2009 10:46 am

    Poor wording? For some, yes, I can see your point. Is it meant to grab you attention like other sermon titles and newspaper headlines are meant to do? I would say yes. Did it? Again, I would say yes.

    How about these…

    “All of Life as Worship” -John Piper. I’m confused. Am I supposed to worship my life?

    “Prepare to Meet your God” – john Piper. WOW! If someone from NS said that it would be taken as a direct threat that I was about to be murdered.

    “Ambushing Satan with Song” – John Piper. Say what? You mean I can catch Satan off guard by singing? (sidenote: If you ever hear me sing it will catch everyone off guard)

    “Better Never to Have Known the Way” -John Piper. Don’t tell me the way, I’m better off lost.

    • James Duncan Sep 22, 2009 10:52 am

      Ben,

      We’re not talking about headlines, which are often designed to be intentionally ambiguous, though they shouldn’t be incorrect. We’re talking about what he actually wrote over an entire paragraph.

      What is WROTE is heresy. What he preached apparently was not, for which we’re glad.

      If heresy is intended to get attention, this did, so you shouldn’t complain that we took his bait.

  19. James Downing Sep 22, 2009 10:53 am

    Not seeing an issue with the Piper titles. They don’t imply anything unbiblical.

  20. Ben Milstead Sep 22, 2009 11:02 am

    I don’t see anything wrong with Pipers headlines either (or Brads). I’m certainly not trying to attack another Pastor. Just trying to illustrate a point.

  21. James Downing Sep 22, 2009 11:18 am

    Your point falls apart because what Brad posted was biblically incorrect.

  22. James Downing Sep 22, 2009 11:22 am

    Also need to point out that holding a pastor’s words up to scripture is not attacking. If John Piper or anyone else teaches something that is unbiblical, you should discard it.

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