Noble rescinds the Ten Commandments for 2015 356

(1/2/2015: Updated with NewSpring’s response. See at the end of the post.)

On Christmas Eve, Perry Noble gifted the world a rewritten Ten Commandments. In so doing, he contradicted Scripture, celebrated his ignorance of the Bible, and ultimately rejected the gospel.

NewSpring was excited that God had given Noble a new Christmas Eve message

NewSpring was excited that God had given Noble a new Christmas Eve message

NewSpring had repeated its Christmas service during the week before Christmas day, yet before the final pre-Christmas service, word went out over the NewSpring social media grapevine that Noble had a new sermon, so everybody should come back to hear it.

Noble raised the stakes at the outset, saying that God had told him the previous day that he needed to deliver this sermon. After some of Noble’s staff confirmed for him that he had heard God speak, Noble wrote the sermon in ten minutes. It showed, but it also provided a disquieting glimpse into Noble’s biblical illiteracy. More than illiteracy, it was biblical rebellion.

Noble denies the Commandments

Noble spent Christmas eve explaining away all ten commandments

Noble spent Christmas Eve explaining away all ten Commandments

Noble’s premise was that what we erroneously know as the Ten Commandments aren’t really commandments. They’re just God’s promises.

He knows this because a Jewish friend who was driving him around Israel told him that there’s no Hebrew word for command. Noble acknowledges that he knows no Hebrew (as if that’s an acceptable thing for a preacher to remain ignorant of), so he takes his driver’s word as fact. Noble describes his friend as being to him as Mr. Miyagi is to the Karate Kid. “I just love this man,” Noble says. “He is full of wisdom. He loves Jesus. …He’s just an amazing man of God, and he’s teaching me the Bible. I’m trying to spend as much time with him as possible and he’s teaching me the Bible.” His friend is a poor teacher, and Noble is an even worse student.

Noble’s tutor tells him that the Ten Commandments are a mirage. Initially, Noble is surprised.

This is weird, because I’ve been around the Ten Commandments all my life. But in the original Hebrew language, there’s no word for command, so it couldn’t have been the Ten Commandments. He said it’s best translated as the Ten Sayings. Then he said this: ‘You could also interpret it as the Ten Promises of God.’ Instead of Ten Commandments that you have to keep if you’re going to be a follower of Jesus, they’re actually ten promises that you can receive when you say yes to Jesus.

Noble then announces that he is going to persuade his audience to say yes to Jesus because they no longer have to worry about obeying the commandments. Before we get to his rewritten commandments, let’s quickly debunk his erroneous premise.

The entire Old Testament is full of references to God’s commands and to the Ten Commandments in particular. In fact, in Deuteronomy 5, the second presentation of the Ten Commandments, God follows the list by repeatedly referring to his law as commands.

Oh that they had such a heart as this always, to fear me and to keep all my commandments, that it might go well with them and with their descendants forever! Go and say to them, “Return to your tents.”

But you, stand here by me, and I will tell you the whole commandment and the statutes and the rules that you shall teach them, that they may do them in the land that I am giving them to possess.’

You shall be careful therefore to do as the LORD your God has commanded you. You shall not turn aside to the right hand or to the left.

You shall walk in all the way that the LORD your God has commanded you, that you may live, and that it may go well with you, and that you may live long in the land that you shall possess.

Now this is the commandment—the statutes and the rules—that the LORD your God commanded me to teach you, that you may do them. (Deut 5:29-6:1)

Obviously, the Hebrew word for command is an essential part of the Old Testament. What Noble’s Bible teacher may have been referring to was that the Torah didn’t formally label the list as the Ten Commandments, instead presenting them as ten sayings. Even so, a saying can be a commandment without having to be labeled as such. And we see in Deut 5 that God Himself called them commandments. Noble and his teacher are both very wrong.

A quick Google search would have torpedoed Noble's sermon

A quick Google search would have torpedoed Noble’s sermon

(For a man who has assumed the responsibility of pastoring around 40,000 people, why couldn’t he have spent just a few minutes consulting a concordance, calling someone who does know Hebrew, or even Googling it? Even Google knows Noble’s claim is incorrect.)

From the New Testament, we see that Jesus understood them as commandments in his response to the rich young man in Matthew 19.

“If you would enter life, keep the commandments.” He said to him, “Which ones?” And Jesus said, “You shall not murder, You shall not commit adultery, You shall not steal, You shall not bear false witness, Honor your father and mother, and, You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”

For Jesus, commandments referred to the list we know as the Ten Commandments (even though he abbreviated the list here).

Right away, we have a problem with Jesus’ advice if we are to take Noble’s teaching seriously. Noble says that being a Christian doesn’t require obedience, yet Jesus insists on it. The point of Jesus’ exchange with the rich young man was that it was impossible for anyone to actually keep the commandments. The disciples see the problem, to their horror.

When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished, saying, “Who then can be saved?” But Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

To be saved we must obey the Ten Commandments, but we can’t, so it’s impossible for us to be saved by anything we do. The only way to salvation is though the Mediator that God graciously provides for us and whose perfect obedience he credits to us. This is the gospel of grace and the wonder of Christ.

If the commandments don’t even need to be obeyed, there’s nothing to be saved from and no need for the Mediator. All we need to do, in Noble’s formulation, is to say yes to Jesus, something that even this rich young man couldn’t do.

Noble is denying the gospel, not preaching it.

Noble rewrites the Commandments

Noble compounds his error by arbitrarily rewriting what’s left of the commandments to make them palatable for nonbelievers, even though he’s told us that they’re legally irrelevant. Noble presents his version by starting with the original biblical commandment, then wiping it off the screen and replacing it with his own version. God’s commands appeared on Noble’s big screen for 4 minutes and 12 seconds, but Noble’s commandments got 20:41 of screen time. Here’s what Noble wishes the commandments could be:

1) You shall have no other gods before me becomes You do not have to live in constant disappointment anymore.

Noble intimates that the command is selfish and unreasonable. (Check his body language at 35:36 on the video as he wags his finger, as if angry and demanding.) This sets the tone for the rest of Noble’s revision in which commandments that are focused on God and others become favors focused on us. God exists to make us happy.

2) You shall not make an image becomes You can be free from rituals and religion and trust in a relationship.

Noble talks about people who think incorrectly that their good religious works like church attendance and Bible reading will save them. That point is correct, but by rejecting the concept of the law in the first place, Noble has created a system where good works aren’t even necessary. If there’s no offense against God through breaking his law, there’s no need for reconciliation and no need for the Savior. In Noble’s universe, there’d be no Jesus for anyone to say yes to.

3) You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain becomes You can trust in a name that’s above every name.

Noble complains that Christians have butchered the commandment by prohibiting people from saying darn, a point illustrated with a story about being freaked out by a witch mannequin at a party store. Such is biblical exposition at NewSpring.

4) Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy becomes You can rest.

This is another one that Noble claims that Christians have butchered, thinking that God would kill them for doing yard work on Sunday. Given that Noble had already cancelled church for the following Sunday, it was important for him to ignore the clear meaning of this one. Sabbath breakers prefer not to preach too much about this commandment. Moving on…

5) Honor your father and mother becomes Your family does not have to fall apart.

He complains that parents use this as a “spiritual grenade” by teaching their children that the Bible tells them to honor and obey their children. This is improper, says Noble, because there’s no Hebrew word for command.

Like the Sabbath commandment, this is another awkward one for NewSpring, which often encourages its youth to reject parental authority in favor of NewSpring’s programs and teachings. Common in these parts are stories of families being torn apart by children and young adults who break from their Christian parents in favor of NewSpring, or leave college against their parents’ wishes to attend NewSpring College. NewSpring leaders know that big family events like Christmas often precipitate family conflict over NewSpring, so they prepare young people with articles like this one published in early December entitled My Family Thinks I Belong To A Cult. If young people don’t have to honor their parents, they can’t be talked out of their cults.

6) You shall not murder becomes You do not have to live in a constant state of anger because you will be motivated by love and not hate.

Noble uses this as yet another opportunity to beat up on other Christians.

I think one of the things that bothers me most about Christians is how hateful we seem to come across sometimes. I mean, we’re just mean. And we tend to be mean at people that are very different from us. Theologically, if you don’t agree just like me, I’m going to be mean to you. Moralistically, if you don’t agree with me then I’m going to be mean to you. But then, as we read about the person of Jesus, he just wasn’t mean to very many people (except the Pharisees–called then sons of hell), but to other people, he’s just this loving guy.

Yet again, Noble ignores the sin problem that requires the gospel. God hates sin, and because we were sinners, God hated us. (Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.) Because God’s hate is righteous, it’s holy and good, unlike ours. As we saw earlier, Jesus proclaimed the need to obey God’s law, which is impossible to do perfectly, making us lawbreakers and enemies of God. The good news is that, for those God gave to him, Jesus mediates between us and God with his perfect obedience, meaning that we meet God as our adoptive father rather than as an avenging judge.

Without an understanding of God’s terrifying hate, his love is meaningless.

7) You shall not commit adultery becomes You do not have to live a life dominated by the guilt, pain and shame associated with sexual sin.

Perhaps Noble could tell us what now constitutes sexual sin if there are no commandments regulating sexual behavior. From whence comes the guilt and shame if there is no law forbidding anything? By Noble’s logic, you’re free to commit adultery (whatever that is now) so that you can experience the blessing of having your shame removed.

Noble proudly claims that, unlike most other preachers, he likes to talk about sex and thinks that it’s good so long as it’s in the context of a heterosexual marriage. The problem is that by removing the law against sex outside of marriage, there’s nothing morally commendable or God pleasing about marital sex. Noble promises God’s forgiveness for sexual sin, but there’s no need for forgiveness if there have been no laws broken. By revoking the law, Noble erases the blessing.

8) You shall not steal becomes I will provide.

Noble prefaces this by saying that he actually thinks this is a good command (God must be relieved), but it makes a better promise. Noble assures us that God provides for his children, though his examples limit God’s provision to material benefits. His interpretation of God’s paternal care being linked to American commercialism would surprise believers in other parts of the world and other eras.

9) You shall not give false testimony against your neighbor becomes You do not have to pretend.

Contrary to what you understand from a plain reading of Scripture, this is not intended to benefit your neighbor; it’s really designed for your emotional self indulgence. It’s hermeneutical solipsism; the Bible’s all about me.

Cue another anti-Christian rant:

Church people are famous for pretending. Seriously. Every week in church it’s Halloween. People dress up in costumes, pretending to be someone that they’re really not. It’s a shackle that religion has held on people for far too long….When you know Jesus, you don’t have to pretend for a bunch of people who don’t know him anyway.

All those other non-NewSpring churches, in other words, are full of liars who aren’t actually Christians. (If NewSpringers ever wonder why parents worry that their kids have joined a cult, preaching like this is a clue.)

Noble doesn’t truly believe in removing his own masks and being fully transparent, however. As Chris Rosebrough was first to document, earlier in the sermon Noble accidentally used the N-word while recounting a conversation he’d had with a single friend about whether he should just buy himself a dog over his wife’s objections. Noble said, “I was like, ‘N*****, ca…'” at which point he stopped being honest and changed the topic. In the context of the moment, the word could be nothing else but what it sounded like, and it suggests that he regularly addresses someone in his life by that awful term.

Contrary to Noble’s hypocritical call to full transparency, some things ought to remain opaque. This side of heaven, we’re sinners with thoughts and desires that all-too-frequently violate all ten commandments. With the Holy Spirit’s sanctifying help, we work to make our fallen hearts fully subject to God’s moral law, but it is good for us and all of our neighbors that we keep most our internal ugliness just between ourselves and the Holy Spirit. The ability to do that is part of God’s common grace that holds societies together.

10) You shall not covet becomes I will be enough.

Noble starts by saying that the command against coveting donkeys, oxen or servants seems irrelevant, so he has to wrestle with this one. Now that he’s discovered that it’s not actually a command, he doesn’t have to worry about coveting donkeys any more.

If the true meaning of this command was that God was enough, God had already stated this in the preface to the Commandments when he reminded his people, “I am the Lord you God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt.” This is not the same as the command that we must not covet.


Noble finishes the sermon by telling his audience that he has given them ten reasons to say yes to Christ, then leads them in a prayer that starts, “Jesus Christ, I know that I’m a sinner and I need your forgiveness. I believe you died on the cross and you rose from the grave to pay for my sin. I receive your payment.”

There was nothing in the sermon that supported any of the points in the prayer. How would Noble’s audience know they were sinners? Noble erased the law, so nobody in his audience ought to think of themselves as sinners. What laws have they broken that require forgiveness?

There’s nothing in the sermon to explain the need for Christ (besides him being someone that for some reason pleads for us to say yes to him), nor why he would need to die on a cross. Why was the resurrection important, especially when the cross seems unnecessary? What is Jesus paying for, and why is it me that’s receiving the payment? It’s backwards. God receives the payment because I cannot possibly pay. Jesus was sacrificed for me, not to me.

After the prayer, Noble tells those who prayed to sign a name tag to show that they have “nailed it down” with God. Hearing the gospel is a prerequisite to faith and repentance (Rom 10:14), yet nobody at NewSpring that night heard the gospel preached. Nevertheless, Noble confidently assured scores of people that they had just become right with God.

If it still actually mattered, to many of his hearers such a claim would have seriously violated the Ninth Commandment.

Update

NewSpring’s public relations director sent the following reply to a series of questions I had sent asking if Noble stood by his claim that there is no Hebrew word for command, if he still thinks God told him to deliver the message, if he had said the N-word in the sermon, and if he ever used it with other people.

We do stand by the message Perry gave to our church on December 24, 2015, and we do believe the Lord prompted Perry to deliver it as he did.

In regards to your question about the ‘N’ word, Perry doesn’t use that word and doesn’t address anyone in his life by such a word.  He did not use that word in his message and what you perceived as him doing so was [a] matter of words getting jumbled as can happen with anyone who is speaking.

356 thoughts on “Noble rescinds the Ten Commandments for 2015

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  1. Rich Jan 1, 2015 2:08 pm

    Jeremiah 23:32 Behold, I am against those who prophesy false dreams,” says the LORD, “and tell them, and cause My people to err by their lies and by their recklessness. Yet I did not send them or command them; therefore they shall not profit this people at all,” says the LORD.

    The Word of God for Perry Noble and his followers.

  2. Stephen Jan 1, 2015 2:35 pm

    Thank you for your faithfulness to Jesus Christ, to sound Biblical doctrine, and for not letting Noble’s musings go unchecked, Dr. Duncan. You will surely reap the rewards of your labor in heaven some day. Blessings to you.

  3. Mark Prez Jan 1, 2015 7:17 pm

    Thanks Mr. Duncan for the review…missed you. Here is something of potential interest in terms of “what the fat’s going on”…I have tried multiple times to hear Perry’s sermon in full and at minute mark 33.26 every time….4 times counting…my internet connection goes down…spares me the agony of having to hear any more of Perry’s rants…but my internet connection is high speed and has no problems with anything else today/tonight. In fact…pajamapages offers no internet problems from start to finish….go figure!!!

  4. Sterry Groscoll Jan 2, 2015 8:33 am

    Perry Noble would be blessed to hold God in greater fear.

  5. SDG Jan 2, 2015 11:09 am

    Thank you for posting this. It is quite shameful how Noble, and others, blatantly mishandle the Biblical languages. I thought I would pass along something from his cohort, Steven Furtick, back in October, 2014 which will further prove the point of such pastors shamefully mishandling the texts.

    The link to the sermon is here (and it will start at the section I’m discussing):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=SRVFT2LEP_s#t=822 – In this part of the sermon, Furtick talks about Greek – quite mockingly. He even takes the time to say that he didn’t really like or pay attention in those classes in seminary.

    Among other things, he he says that the Greek word for being anxious in Phil 4:7 is miramnate and it’s cool because it sounds like marinate – so don’t let yourself marinate in problems. The second part of the word sounds like “knot” which is cool because if you let yourself get stuck thinking about problems you will work yourself into knots. Instead of taking the standard approach of actually discussing what the Greek word means and why that is important to the text, he takes a “popular” approach of just talking about how the words sound like something else but which really isn’t helpful in the long run other than to make a pithy point.

    By the way, if the word sounds like “marinate”, then that would mean that the second part of the word could not sound like “knot” since “marinate” and “knot” do not sound alike…

  6. Deana Holmes Jan 2, 2015 2:36 pm

    You write:
    I appreciate your criticisms of Perry Noble, but I just want to bring one thing up.

    Without an understanding of God’s terrifying hate, his love is meaningless.

    I’m told to love my neighbor as myself and to forgive others seventy times seven. However, God is apparently not under those rules and can have a “terrifying hate” because I may not have the right idea of him in my head and say the right words that indicate I hold the orthodox beliefs.

    I am never going to understand how God can be all-loving and yet have this terrifying (all-consuming?) hate for people who just don’t get it right. And that’s one reason why I’ve walked away from the church.

    • Andrew Jan 2, 2015 6:41 pm

      It sounds like you have missed the sweet and blessed Gospel in all of this Deana. It’s apparent to me that you know you’re a sinner and that God hates sin. According to the Law, we are guilty and God hates the sin and the sinner. This is in Scripture.

      But behold! In Christ, He loves you. Because of what Christ did, you are loved by God. The forgiveness of sins is there and it is for YOU.

      //”I am never going to understand how God can be all-loving and yet have this terrifying (all-consuming?) hate for people who just don’t get it right.”//

      It’s not about having it right, although that is important. It’s about Christ. In Christ, and in Him alone, are we loved. Christ died for YOU, rose for YOU, and forgives YOU. He gives this all to us in one-sided divine gifts of grace; Baptism, the preached Word, the Lord’s Holy Supper.

    • Andrew Jan 2, 2015 6:43 pm

      It sounds like your experience with churches has been in churches that are all commands (Law) and no promises (Gospel).

      You need some unconditional unmerited grace. It really is all about Christ, because frankly, we all suck.

  7. Josh Jan 2, 2015 3:14 pm

    Noble should be mindful of Christ’s words in Matthew 5:17-19: “Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.”

    The ironic thing, though, is that Noble very much believes in at least one “commandment”, that is, his teaching that Christians are commanded to give ten percent of their (pre-tax!) earnings to a local church. This commandment, according to Noble, is so important that God will go so far as to curse the money of those who don’t obey it. You can be certain that if Noble’s chauffeur told him that New Testament believers aren’t bound by a “tithe” he wouldn’t just readily pass that teaching on to the masses at New Spring.

    I do disagree on one point though, with you and a few of the commenters. Noble’s ridiculous Christmas “message” isn’t proof that believers need to be diligently studying Greek and Hebrew, it’s a great example of why believers should avoid pastors purporting to explain “the original Greek/Hebrew.” Time and again I see prideful false teachers change the clear meaning of a passage in that way. Too often they go unchallenged because those in the pews are uneducated in the foreign language, but more importantly they are biblically illiterate. Nothing in the bible suggests that English speakers (or speakers of any other language) should undertake learning a foreign language so they can understand God’s word. In Paul’s teaching about the qualifications of deacons and elders, “knowledge of Greek or Hebrew” isn’t listed, nor were the Bereans lauded for their study of the Hebrew language. Instead, as in the example of Pentecost, we see God’s words being translated into the language of the hearer. I don’t need Google translate or a professor of Hebrew to tell me Noble is full of hot air when he claims the Ten Commandments aren’t actually commandments; I have my bible, which is in English, the same language I speak and read. (I mention this only in passing as food for thought. Arguments about whether the King James (or any other version) of the English bible are inspired invariably leads down a rabbit hole.)

    In any event, thanks for the post. Hopefully, Dr. Duncan, it’s the sign of more active blogging on 2015. I always enjoy your posts!

  8. Saiko Woods Jan 2, 2015 3:27 pm

    As a Christian and a black man, I’m doubly offended.

    1. Noble eisegetes the text in favor of his own sinful preference (Prov. 30:6).

    2. His blatant denial of using the N word in a public format (being from Detroit, I know how the word is used quite well).

    • Cali Jan 3, 2015 1:06 am

      I was at the service and I can assure you that He did not use the N word. I do not know where you guys are getting that from.

      • Ryan Jan 3, 2015 10:25 am

        Well, if you go to you-tube and put in perry noble n word, you can see some clips of that sermon, and it sure sounds like he says it to me… if he didn’t say it, and you were there, maybe you can tell me what word he said there?

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHTQZMt5giY

        • Michael Jan 3, 2015 9:23 pm

          I don’t care what the “official word” is, he said it. Nice try to try and cover it up but he did say it. Video doesn’t lie my friend.

  9. JH Jan 2, 2015 5:24 pm

    Thanks for posting this. As a giga-church/cult veteran I’d like to offer some insights regarding why Perry would say such things. Perry utilizes Robert Morris of Gateway Church’s Blessed/Cursed Life teachings. Perry needs to rewrite the whole commandments/obedience deal because his and Morris’ teachings focus on tithing and extravagant giving as being the number one way we show our obedience to God. If there is no Mosaic/moral law, that better supports NT tithing plus you have no other way to distinguish sin from good works other than by tithing and reeling in more NS customers. That’s also why Perry had to singularly support the do not steal “saying” because he and Morris teach that failure to tithe is stealing from God – no exceptions. Perry approves of that commandment/saying because it enriches him personally.

    Since Perry was in Israel when he received this amazing revelation, I’d like to know why he didn’t confirm this with any scholarly rabbis prior to teaching it as fact? It’s possible the driver was just taking the mick out of this rich, arrogant, hillbilly tourist and he may be having a good chuckle in his kibbutz right now.

    As for the N word…. The blatant lie that the church told to cover this up is more disturbing than Perry dropping the N word in a Christmas sermon (and that’s extremely offensive). At least we now know where Malcom Tucker is working these days.
    http://youtu.be/_VDc7-YH1LA

  10. Hannah Jan 2, 2015 5:51 pm

    All I can say is WOW… this is garbage! I’ve heard this sermon twice and never once did Perry say not to obey the ten commandments. When you read the bible God will reveal different things to you each time you read the same passage (every Christian should know this?), and what was revealed to Perry were 10 promises we can take from the 10 commandments and they were on point. Perhaps the author here should take a break from criticizing and read his or her bible, maybe God would reveal something to them as well. Pajama pages you’re really reaching for this one! (But whats new?)

    • Aaron Jan 2, 2015 7:34 pm

      Hannah,

      I do not believe that God reveals something each time you read the same passage.

      A right understanding of the Bible is that it IS Revelation from God and we come to it attempting to understand what that revelation says.

      As we approach the Bible, we pray for illumination, understanding, and appropriate application. But we should never seek revelation because the Bible, by definition, is revelation.

      • Hannah Jan 3, 2015 12:35 pm

        Aaron, I’m so sorry that you feel that way. One of God’s greatest gifts to us is the Bible, it is one of his greatest forms of communicating with us and comforting us through the different moments in our lives. Each time you read it you should be learning something new, he should be revealing himself to you through it. I am saddened that you are missing out on this and hope you start to further grow in your relationship with Him. God bless!

    • Joshua Jan 3, 2015 2:18 am

      Perry Noble has an incredible gift for relating Jesus and the Bible to everyday people. When I heard the message, there was nothing that stood out to me that made it sound like he was attempting to rewrite the commandments. Perry is absolutely not perfect and he is the first to admit it.

      -How many unbelievers were saved, or believers brought closer to Christ from his Christmas Eve message?- probably many many more than this article will generate

      I should say that if you listen to Perry preach enough times, you can tell he is far from a racist. He preaches against it with passion. He, like many others in the south, grew up surrounded by it. He has helped countless people shed layer after layer of racism that has been ingrained in them. After Jesus takes that away from you, it is a freeing experience.

      It is never right to say racist words- intentionally or by accident. Did it sound like he was mimicking a comic?– yes. Does that make it ok–No. Will it push more people further from Christ than this article will?–probably not.

      Will his unintentional verbiage bring Perry some humility?–yes
      Is this why God intended it to happen?– quite possibly
      Will this generate a little stir on the internet and social circles?– yes
      Will it cause many more people to view that Christmas message than would have normally?– yes
      Will that result in more salvations?– very very likely
      Is this an example of Jesus Christ using our mistakes to bring about His glory and purpose?– that sounds like the same Jesus I know

  11. Hannah Jan 2, 2015 6:10 pm

    Also I’m 100% sure God did not call you to be newspring’s number 1 critic. Please consider spending your time more wisely. God probably has a lot for you that you’re missing all because you’re wrapped up in hate. God bless.

    • Bill Jan 2, 2015 9:32 pm

      Hannah,

      That is a self refuting statement. By criticizing those that criticize, you Condemn yourself with your own words.

      It’s good to have folks pointing out false teachers. I know you believe this, because even though you are misguided, you are displaying the moral stand that those doing wrong must be corrected.

      Please show us via the scripture that those commenting have something that God would rather have them doing, since it is what scripture actually says and teaches that we are held accountable to.

      Thanks.

      • Hannah Jan 3, 2015 11:59 am

        I was not speaking to the people commenting on the blog, I’m talking directly to the blogger, who spends his entire life trying to bash newspring. And as always, he is stretching and pulling the truth to make his arguments which is hardly “exposing false teachers”. If the author were truly called to expose false teachers he might consider refocusing his attention to the mega church in the upstate that actually IS changing what the bible says.(RWOC?!) As long as pajama pages is twisting the truth trying to frame Perry Noble, he is not doing what God has called him to do.

        Exodus 20:16 Thou shall not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

        • James Duncan Jan 3, 2015 12:05 pm

          Hannah, before the 10 Commandments post, when was the last time PP had a new article about NewSpring?

          • John A. Jan 3, 2015 12:33 pm

            The 10 commandments are commands, they are commands we are unable to keep especially when we see them as Jesus did in the sermon on the mount. We break every one of them every day. It seems Noble is trying to make the same point as Tullian Tchividjian does in his recent 10 Commandments series. The law exposes our need for Jesus. We are justified by faith in his finished work, not by our works. Noble is just much more clumsy about it. This probably isn’t the heresy PP portrays it as but it’s not good preaching either. Noble’s style/approach obviously appeals to a certain audience and many will outgrow it. There is truth in what he says but there is also much absurdity in the delivery.

  12. Liz Jan 2, 2015 7:20 pm

    A good reason we should be reading and studying and spending time in God’s word for ourselves… But God is not mocked…

  13. Amy Scurry Jan 2, 2015 8:08 pm

    Although I don’t agree with Noble’s teaching here (mega church preachers don’t tend to major on holiness), there is a serious problem with the Dr. Duncan’s response. Jesus did not come to show us salvation through grace alone because people couldn’t possibly keep the 10 Commandments. Many Jews kept the 10 Commandments perfectly. Jesus showed us that the way of the kingdom, and salvation, would demand our whole earthly treasure, our whole life.

    Look at Dr. Duncan’s error in pulling the example of the rich young ruler out of context. The Dr. Duncan says:

    “The point of Jesus’ exchange with the rich young man was that it was impossible for anyone to actually keep the commandments. The disciples see the problem, to their horror.”

    But the rich young ruler did keep all the commandments! Here is the rest of the story in Matthew 19:

    “Jesus replied, “‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, 19 honor your father and mother,’ and ‘love your neighbor as yourself.’”
    20 “All these I have kept,” the young man said. “What do I still lack?”
    21 Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
    22 When the young man heard this, he went away sad because he had great wealth.
    23 Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly I tell you, it is hard for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of heaven. 24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”
    25 When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?”

    If the rich young ruler had not kept the commandments, Jesus would have said he was lying. No, really Jesus told him that keeping the law was not enough.

    Jesus’ gospel of salvation, and the disciples’ “horror,” was not that we can’t keep all God’s commandments, therefore we can’t be saved by anything we do, it was that Jesus was calling us to give up EVERYTHING, all of our wealth and human treasure, to gain the kingdom. Being able to give everything away is the work of God (with God all things are possible), not the human accomplishments of following a list of do’s and don’t’s.

    As a matter of fact, Jesus often got into arguments with the Pharisees because they were careful to keep every letter of the law, including the 10 Commandments, but they neglected mercy. The Pharisees tried to trick Jesus into choosing the law over mercy, by healing the man with the crippled hand (doing work) on the Sabbath, and healing the woman caught in adultery. You could actually say Jesus broke the Sabbath commandment, and after healing the man, the Pharisees did indeed start their plot to kill Jesus (Mark 3: 1-6).

    • Sara Jan 3, 2015 12:06 am

      I think you could argue that the rich man failed to uphold the first and second commandments with his obvious love of money.

  14. Tom Jan 2, 2015 8:43 pm

    I have never read anything on this site before, and only did so because this was posted on Facebook.

    As a member/owner at NewSpring for two years, and as someone – unlike the author – who attended the Christmas Eve service with my two teen children, I am completely shocked by what I just read.

    I am a white man with many African-American friends, and it is evident to anyone who’s ever attended our church that Perry Noble is as far from racist as you can be. I listened and took notes during the sermon in question, and I did not here Perry use the N-word, either by accident or otherwise.

    I can only assume the author is threatened that an “unlearned” pastor could lead more people to Christ in a week than he or his church could in a lifetime.

    I’m sorry the author longs for the days of my youth, hearing “Just ad I am” played over and over til one sad soul came down front for baptism.

    • Reformed Berean Jan 2, 2015 11:52 pm

      Then tell me what you THINK Perry said, bit.ly/1BgxRpj if it wasnt the N word?

      Have you read up on the History of James Duncan and his ordeal with Newspring? He was actually threatened and harassed by members of Newspring’s staff. Why were THEY so threatened by James?

      And YOU have ZERO idea of how many people have came to Christ that attend Newspring and those that were ACTUAL conversions were led to Christ by the Holy Spirit, not Perry.

      Again, you are just another blind follower of Perry Noble that would rather go off on ad hominen attacks vs James Duncan rather than address the content of what was said here in this article.

      “There are none so blind that them that refuse to see”

    • Sara Jan 3, 2015 12:13 am

      Is the salvation of “one sad soul” not sacred and beautiful? Do not the heavens still rejoice?

      • An Interested Reader Jan 4, 2015 12:25 am

        Sara, that made my heart smile.

        Tom, I honestly believe that Noble got tripped up over hos tongue and it coincidentally came out that way. It does sound very kuch like he’s said it but I don’t think people understand how nerve racking it is to speak in front of a huge crowd. You can definitely trip over your words. I’m not defending Noble but I will not condemn him either. If that is his biggest crime, may his blessings grow.

  15. ME Jan 2, 2015 9:16 pm

    After reading the comment about Steven Furtick’s sermon, I went back and listened to the sermon again. Although, I heard it the day he preached in at Elevation, the church I attend. My families life has been and continues to be changed because of what Christ did on the cross, the repentance of sin, which is shared weekly from the pulpit. I fully understand we are nothing without Christ and He is the savior of this fallen world, also shared regularly from the mouth of Steven Furtick. I was saved when I was 13 years old and am now 44. My husband and I raised our two children to love and fear God. Bible reading was a regular occurrence in our home. Unfortunately, we have choices and both of my children have strayed. I’m not going into detail here but want you to know Lives are being changed because of the truth of God’s word being preached. Enough said. PLEASE CONSIDER NOT POSTING THINGS THAT ARE COUNTER PRODUCTIVE TO GROWING THE KINGDOM!!! I would like to say I have never commented on any of these posts. I PRAY A LOT THAT GOD WILL KEEP MY HEART PURE. TO PUT THE FULL ARMOUR ON AND BE AWARE OF THE SCHEMES OF THE DEVIL. This is why I doubted and went back to listen to Steven’s furtick again, I don’t see it. The Perry Noble thing needs more research and I am concerned until I hear it for myself. I am not naïve, I understand the evil ones wants to confuse. I just don’t see it here.

  16. Jimmy savage Jan 2, 2015 9:40 pm

    first of all, if we are following the example of Jesus, we no longer have to fight hard to earn our salvation because he came to Earth to GIVE it to us. We no longer live in the old covenant but the new one. And because of Jesus dying for us we can have peace not having to labor over following the Ten Commandments because there is not a soul in the world who can follow them perfectly. That’s why Jesus came to ABLOISH the law because not ONE of us can follow it without failure. By you posting this you aren’t loving your neighbor and are being quick to criticize one for teaching on JESUS’ teachings. It is by Gods grace we are able to not be perfect because he has already made us white as snow. And through that we can find all the treasures Jesus promises.

    • SDG Jan 2, 2015 11:13 pm

      Jimmy, so you say that Jesus came to abolish the Law??

      What did Jesus himself say in rebuke of the statement that you just made?

      Matthew 5:17 ESV

      Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

  17. Stephen Jan 2, 2015 10:18 pm

    Tom,

    I’m shocked you think your unlearned pastor leads people to Christ when the Bible is crystal clear that it is Christ himself who draws sinners unto himself.

    The “you’re jealous my pastor has led more people to Jesus in one week than you’ve done in a lifetime” is a horribly idolatrous statement, one you should repent of and be forgiven.

    • Sara Jan 3, 2015 12:18 am

      Stephen,

      You took the words right out of my mouth. When I read Tom’s post, I immediately thought: Hero worship much?

      One time I had a NS’er make the comment: “Perry Noble is really using God to change the world.” I almost choked on the food I was eating.

  18. Brad Jan 2, 2015 10:54 pm

    This is a poorly written article filled with taking quotes completely out of context. You should line up all of the people who have been saved at NewSpring and just tell them that their salvation means nothing. See how they take that. Try watching the video again.

  19. Mary Jan 2, 2015 11:18 pm

    Revelation 22:18 For I testify unto every man who hears the words of the Prophecy of this Book, if any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him plagues that are written in this Book.

  20. Vinnie Jan 2, 2015 11:30 pm

    How is it that this clown is ordained, much less the head of one of the largest churches on the east coast? Geez, I’ll never understand.

  21. Todd Pruitt Jan 2, 2015 11:49 pm

    Ghastly false teaching. He denies what Scripture clearly says and even gives false information about the Hebrew language and claims Jesus told him to do it. This is shameful. And to see how his defenders still cover for him is a sad sight. It’s a demonstration of the power of men like Noble and Furtick. He can deny that the 10 Commandments are commandments and still they defend him.

  22. KM Jan 2, 2015 11:53 pm

    What an interesting read!

    I honestly thought the sermon was one of the best I’ve ever heard. It was a perfect reminder of God’s grace. I learned a few years ago, the Ten Commandments were to act as a reminder that we were in total need of Jesus because ultimately, no man could keep the commandments…how encouraging!
    To hear a new take, a different perspective, that doesn’t contradict that we need Jesus, was refreshing and freeing.
    Looking back on these and reflecting, they are legitimate promises that I believe can be found again and again in the Bible. They are reminders that I really can trust God and believe He is who He says He is. I would love to say I always trust God to be exactly who He says He is, I would love to say that I am always obedient to the commandments or that I never sin, but I’m human. Sin is in my nature.
    What’s so good about Jesus though, it isn’t about my sin. It was never about my sin. It’s about Jesus. I’m going to love Him the best way I know how…that’s my obedience. God’s definition of obedience is belief! In order to want to be obedient, to love Him well, I have to have faith that He’s God and He’s good. That He’s for His glory and my joy, in that order.
    No, this isn’t the typical outlook on the Ten Commandments. But this isn’t heresy either. It doesn’t discredit the Bible. It doesn’t go against the Bible. It doesn’t discredit the Gospel, it is an exclamation of what Jesus did on the cross because it points back to how God has pursued us from the very beginning.
    I’m very thankful for the boldness and transparency of Perry Noble.
    My life has been changed because of how the Lord has worked through Perry Noble and NewSpring Church.
    My family has been changed because of how the Lord has blessed us through the love and discipleship of Perry Noble and NewSpring Church.

  23. AM Jan 2, 2015 11:56 pm

    As one who is originally from the Carolinas, I am regularly discouraged and disheartened by the unsound doctrine filling people’s souls under Noble’s and Furtick’s ministries. Thank you for your faithfulness and for contending for the faith. It is evident that you desire to see the Lord honored by seeing his sufficient Word properly interpreted and preached.

  24. KM Jan 3, 2015 12:18 am

    To Whom it May Concern:
    I have been inviting a friend of mine who doesn’t know the Lord to come to church with me. She is hopeless and broken hearted. I have encouraged her the best I know how. I have shared the Gospel with her many times. I asked her to come to church with me, because I knew she would love the music and I knew she would finally find a home where she felt accepted at NewSpring Church. She said she would go, but then she read this post. She read your entire blog and immediately became angry with the only church she would consider attending. She has been so burned by other churches and Christians and she refuses to go any other place. I know the Lord can change her heart ANYWHERE. I know the Lord can open her ears and eyes at ANY moment, but I don’t understand why a man who loves God, who knows Him, would write such things that seem (and I’m sure you don’t mean it to come off this way, at all) counter productive to the Great Commission. I have also read the other posts of this blog. I have heard your story many times from several different mouths, including through your own posts. I know you have been hurt, and I don’t justify anything that was said or done. But good news, God’s a God of grace and justice! So, what is a vendetta in this world? It means nothing in the end and God receives the justice and the glory for all good and all bad. (Ecclesiastes 12:14) Jesus’ prayer for His disciples, for us, was to come together in unity. (John 17) Can we not stand as a unified front?

    Ministry is hard. There’s no need for us to fight each other.

    I’m not asking you to love NewSpring. I’m not asking you to write differently. You as a writer, should write to your convictions.

    This is just how a few of your writings have affected a small town waitress who just wants to love people and tell them about Jesus.

    Thank you for your time and transparency.

  25. Jason Jan 3, 2015 12:43 am

    If it is true that there is no word for commandment, which I believe is true, than you cannot argue that with another verse that has the word commandment. In the NT when Jesus refers to laws I believe He is referring to other laws that are throughout the OT. The Ten Commandments or Ten Sayings are not the only laws in the OT.
    I also do not understand how someone can be so hateful towards another church that is leading so many to Christ. NewSpring may be doing it differently but they are not doing it wrong. I grew up in a southern baptist church and I have been going to NewSpring for the past 5 months. In those 5 months I have grown more spiritually than my entire life.

  26. K Davis Jan 3, 2015 12:44 am

    This world has completely forgotten what zGod has said about not judging others. Treat people with respect and be united as one with God leading all of us. If you get to the Cross by backflipping down the isles, hopping over a fence, listening to a pastor or on your on free will; isn’t the awesomen point that you found Christ? Aren’t we ALL supposed to set an example of how to live by our own actions towards others. This man has a goal of reaching 100,000 people for Christ, let Him do it.

  27. K Davis Jan 3, 2015 12:46 am

    This world has completely forgotten what God has said about not judging others. Treat people with respect and be united as one with God leading all of us. If you get to the Cross by backflipping down the isles, hopping over a fence, listening to a pastor or on your on free will; isn’t the awesomen point that you found Christ? Aren’t we ALL supposed to set an example of how to live by our own actions towards others. This man has a goal of reaching 100,000 people for Christ, let Him do it.

    • Tikatu Jan 3, 2015 2:01 pm

      Then, K Davis, why is it that Perry badmouths other ministries, other churches, from his pulpit? If we should be “treating people with respect and be united as one”, why doesn’t Noble do the same? Why doesn’t he “set an example of how to live” by his actions toward others?

  28. Jason Jan 3, 2015 1:02 am

    Check with the professors at your very own university and see what they have to say. I was taught there is no word for commandment.

    Stop hating on a church and pastor that is doing great things. You don’t have to agree but like in KM ‘s comment you are turning people away from the Gospel.

  29. Todd Wilhelm Jan 3, 2015 1:42 am

    I am not shocked by Noble’s bold display of antinomianism. It would seem that a huge segment of the evangelical world is given over to this heretical teaching. The distinguished Dr. Thomas Schreiner, associate dean and the James Buchanan Harrison Professor of New Testament at The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary in Louisville, Kentucky, leads the way in teaching our future conservative leaders this error.

    “When discussing Passover, I noted that believers are not required to observe the feasts, festivals, and special days of the Old Testament calendar. This includes the Sabbath, even though the Sabbath is part of the Ten Commandments (Exod. 20:8-11). Such a judgment surprises some, but it must be recognized that the entirety of the Old Testament law is abrogated in Christ.”

    -Thomas R. Schreiner, “40 Questions About Christians and Biblical Law” page 91

    This controversy is not new. Indeed Luther and Melanchthon opposed their fellow theologian John Agricola when he taught the same things Thomas Schreiner is teaching.

    A good read on the subject matter is Antinomianism: Reformed Theology’s Unwelcome Guest? By Mark Jones – See more at: http://www.reformation21.org/shelf-life/antinomianism-reformed-theologys-unwelcome-guest.php#sthash.o7PjJLNX.dpuf

    Another good book on the subject matter has been authored by Timothy J. Wengert titled “Law and Gospel: Philip Melanchthon’s Debate with John Agricola of Eisleben over Poenitentia.

  30. Stephen Jan 3, 2015 1:44 am

    K Davis,

    God did not say to not judge others in the sense that you mean it. Christians are not commanded to sit on the sidelines and let falsehoods and nuances in doctrine go uncorrected in the name of unity. You’ve taken scripture of out of context to get to that end, in which case you seem to have learned from Noble quite well.

    Perhaps you should read and study Acts 17.

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